HOT TOPICS
SPOTLIGHT AGENCIES
Again - HSRL Or Metro ?
Written By Naveen - 3 August, 2009
Bangalore Media Reports HSRL Transportation public transport Mobilicity Metro Rail Commuter rail
This report from TOI states that BMRC may build a Metro route to BIAL instead of HSRL due to ongoing recession & lack of interset by private parties - the old debate has resurfaced, yet again.
The solution may be for BMRC to build elevated double sets of tracks along Bellary road /highway to operate less frequent express /skip-stop services to BIA (say, once each half-hour), simultaneously with more frequent regular metro along the route up to Devanahalli - something like "killing two birds with one stone" !
The financial approach can be the same as for other Metro routes being built in the city - ie. utilise public funds & loans instead of involving private sector funding. Viability gap funding (VGF) has already been approved by the central govt for this - thus, some financial relief has already been obtained.
COMMENTS
Naveen - 4 August, 2009 - 09:02
Metro needs large scale land acquisition - What are we talking here? Lets compare apples to apples..DMRCL is on Broad guage and we are on Std..HSRL is smaller than std guage metro train? Is HSRL a monorail ?
As per my understanding, HSRL is defnitely not a monorail. It is a fast train designed along the eastern edge on Bellary rd involving minimal land acquistion due to absence of stations en-route. If a Metro has to be built along the same alignment, it would involve more land acquisition since there would be stations & pedestrian infrastructure every kilometer. Doubling tracks (elevated) to allow for a limited or non-stop service to BIAL will involve more land acquisition, but makes sense, in my opinion since there is a need for a smaller (3-coach) fast train exclusively for BIAL & the business park employees apart from another service that connects various other intermediate points to the city.
Metro travel time from city to BIA is one hour, HSRL 23 minutes - 23 or 35 min assured is ok with us
A Metro train that stops each kilometer along the way will not make it to BIAL in 35 minutes - the distance is some 33 kms from MG road. So, at an average speed of 32 km (including stops), it will take just over 60 minutes.
Metro not ideal for connecting far off places like BIA..Metro is viable only if the ridership is over 25,000 per hour per direction - We are trying to develop devanahalli area and yelahanka..should this be still a problem ?
Lets see it this way - Bangalore's spread so far has been in the south & east /west, mostly. Thus, EC is a good 45km+ away from BIAL for most. This is a very large distance for any city airport. In comparison, even NewYork's JFK is closer from the furthest points of the city. Thus, commuters bound for the airport & surrounds do need a service that goes fast since a regular Metro will take longer than road transport (ie. taxis).
Metro cannot have check-in facilities - Who needs these anyways when ppl are doin telechekin and net check in
Not all use tele or net check-in. What about those with heavy suitcases ? Remote checkin facilities were designed to address this lot, primarily. If a fast train is available that also includes these services, most would opt for this, but if a Metro takes over an hour, there may be fewer takers for it.
Metro connecting airport in other countries hardly patronised - False stmt..was checking on busiest apts around the world..Atlanta/Chicage etc..all have local trains to apt
True, but the distances to the airport & travel time by a regular Metro in these cities may be shorter.
HSRL doesn’t need much land as it runs on pillars - Metro is running on stils for major portion in Blr already
As explained, more land is necessary for Metro than for HSRL.
Have a feeling neither will happen
s_yajaman - 4 August, 2009 - 10:37
If you look at the DPR it had passenger traffic figures of 30 million for 2016-17. BIAL itself thinks it will do about 15 million in 2014/15.
in a global sourcing world nowadays the initial costs and operating costs don't vary much across the world. HK's Airport Express costs 90HKD or about Rs.600. How will this HSRL break even at rs.150 and for a much smaller airport?
Naveen - Metro beyond yelahanka might not need more than 4-5 stops or about one every 3-4 km. The average speed after Yelahanka could be almost 50-60 kmph. Thus about 20 mins to yelahanka and 20 mins beyond that.
Second I am sure that the construction and rolling stock costs for the HSRl will be more than for the Metro. This might very well offset any extra stations needed after Yelahanka for the Metro. Also the tracks till yelahanka can serve Metro as well.
This HSRL will not help E-City much. Reaching MG Road is the real nightmare. For them it is better to extend NICE PRR to NH7. They can average 60 kmph easily and make it in 1 hr.
Anyway - I doubt either will happen :)
Srivathsa
Would Metro be better than HSRL ?
Naveen - 4 August, 2009 - 12:28
Srivathsa :
Projections by BIAL or from the DPR - these give an estimate for only the immediate, known future. If a train is to be built, it will probably be ready only in 2014 (or later), given the slow pace that such mega-infra projects take to plan & build. What about the distant future ? In about 25-30 years, we might see 40 or even 50 million using BIAL each year. Surely, this demands a fast connection, & I think it's better to plan or at least make provision for one now than to regret later (& continue to have the same old Bangalore that we have today !).
Installation costs may be nearly the same everywhere (India benefits only from lower labor costs for building), but operating costs are lower in India due to much lower cost of power & labor. Spare-parts costs will be nearly the same everywhere.
HK's new airport (at Lantau Is.) needs an express as much as we need one here due to the very large distance. It may not cost 600rs, as it does in HK. 250rs is more likely with the cheaper operating costs. Even KL has a rail connection due to the distance & fares are subsidised for airport workers. These calculations have already been made & a VGF of some 1000-odd crores had been arrived at, & has the green signal from the central govt..
I agree - at present, Metro beyond yelahanka might not need more than 4-5 stops or one about every 3-4 km, but what happens later (I mean after about 25 years) ? It may be better to plan the Metro (if one is being built) with fewer stations now, but have options for building them at one-km intervals for the future.
I still feel it's better to have double tracks & have both, or make provision for both. If this were done, airport expresses could even run like normal metros right upto EC & speed up once past Hebbal or Yelahanka - this would be better than HSRL.
Either way (ie. HSRL or Metro), costs may not vary much, but future commuter needs must command what they go in for & not what is convenient to build now or who wins the argument (ABIDe or Govt).
All financial disasters with railways in India (Chennai MRTS, Kolkata Howarh-airport train, Kolkata circular rail, Delhi circular rail, etc.) have occurred because they built what was convenient & where "land was available". None were centered around commuter needs, & certainly, Bangalore must not repeat these same mistakes.
Planning for 25-30 years - need to consider this
s_yajaman - 4 August, 2009 - 13:07
Naveen,
Please check this link out. Might throw some light on 25-30 years hence :) The problem with most projections is that they project history and assume plenty of cheap oil to fund all our growth.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/warning-oil-supplies-are-running-out-fast-1766585.html
"In its first-ever assessment of the world's major oil fields, the IEA concluded that the global energy system was at a crossroads and that consumption of oil was "patently unsustainable", with expected demand far outstripping supply.
Oil production has already peaked in non-Opec countries and the era of cheap oil has come to an end, it warned.
In most fields, oil production has now peaked, which means that other sources of supply have to be found to meet existing demand.
Even if demand remained steady, the world would have to find the equivalent of four Saudi Arabias to maintain production, and six Saudi Arabias if it is to keep up with the expected increase in demand between now and 2030, Dr Birol said. "
I would think very hard before spending 5000 crores on anything except for a city mass transit.
Srivathsa
blrsri - 4 August, 2009 - 08:02
Sreedharan mentioned the following abt HSRL:
*Metro needs large scale land acquisition - What are we talking here? Lets compare apples to apples..DMRCL is on Broad guage and we are on Std..HSRL is smaller than std guage metro train? Is HSRL a monorail?
*Metro travel time from city to BIA is one hour, HSRL 23 minutes - 23 or 35 min assured is ok with us
*Metro not ideal for connecting far off places like BIA..Metro is viable only if the ridership is over 25,000 per hour per direction - We are trying to develop devanahalli area and yelahanka..should this be still a problem?
*Metro cannot have check-in facilities - Who needs these anyways when ppl are doin telechekin and net check in
*Metro connecting airport in other countries hardly patronised - False stmt..was checking on busiest apts around the world..Atlanta/Chicage etc..all have local trains to apt
*HSRL doesn’t need much land as it runs on pillars - Metro is running on stils for major portion in Blr already
Sreedharan is busy with the mishaps in DMRCL..its good if we decide for a Metro now!
PRAJA.IN COMMENT GUIDELINES
Posting Guidelines apply for comments as well. No foul language, hate mongering or personal attacks. If criticizing third person or an authority, you must be fact based, as constructive as possible, and use gentle words. Avoid going off-topic no matter how nice your comment is. Moderators reserve the right to either edit or simply delete comments that don't meet these guidelines. If you are nice enough to realize you violated the guidelines, please save Moderators some time by editing and fixing yourself. Thanks!